Romanism, Mary and The Catechism, Part 1

February 16th, 2005 | 02:22 AM |by Ed "What the" Heckman
(5 years, 5 months, 2 weeks, 15 hours, 4 minutes ago)

Before I get into this reply, I would like to note that Ales Rarus has won a Warnie award. Congratulations Funky!

After my last posting on Mary, Funky Dung posted a brief reply noting my essay and posting two articles from his archives. Neither article was a direct response, and no additional discussion took place in comments, so I can’t really identify where we might agree or disagree on what I last wrote.

The first posting from his archive discussed the issue of praying to the dead as a justification for praying to Mary. Since such a topic encompasses more than just Mary, I’m going to set that discussion aside for another day so I can focus on the Roman Catholic Church’s (RCC) view of Mary.

Not only did Funky post the two articles, he also posted a link to an online version of the “Catechism Of The Catholic Church” (CCC) — the official teachings of the RCC. Because the entire point of this discussion is the teachings of Romanism in comparison to the Bible, I’ve decided to go right to the source.

The CCC is a very long and scholarly document. It consists of 2,865 numbered paragraphs. Most paragraphs include multiple footnotes detailing the source of each teaching. So let’s take a look at what Romanism teaches about Mary and the source of those teachings.

Mary’s Faith

The first mention of Mary (based on the subject index) is paragraph 144:

144 To obey (from the Latin ob-audire, to “hear or listen to”) in faith is to submit freely to the word that has been heard, because its truth is guaranteed by God, who is Truth itself. Abraham is the model of such obedience offered us by Sacred Scripture. The Virgin Mary is its most perfect embodiment.

This paragraph is actually a summary statement containing no footnotes. The detailed explanation of Mary’s faith is offered in paragraphs 148-149:

148 The Virgin Mary most perfectly embodies the obedience of faith. By faith Mary welcomes the tidings and promise brought by the angel Gabriel, believing that “with God nothing will be impossible” and so giving her assent: “Behold I am the handmaid of the Lord; let it be [done] to me according to your word.”12 Elizabeth greeted her: “Blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what was spoken to her from the Lord.”13 It is for this faith that all generations have called Mary blessed.14

149 Throughout her life and until her last ordeal15 when Jesus her son died on the cross, Mary’s faith never wavered. She never ceased to believe in the fulfillment of God’s word. And so the Church venerates in Mary the purest realization of faith.

12 Lk 1:37-38; cf. Gen 18:14.
13 Lk 1:45.
14 Cf. Lk 1:48.
15 Cf. Lk 2:35.

For the most part, these teachings match scripture. But there are differences. The idea that Mary’s faith never wavered doesn’t match Mark 3:21, 31-35.

When his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, “He is out of his mind.”

Then Jesus’ mother and brothers arrived. Standing outside, they sent someone in to call him. A crowd was sitting around him, and they told him, “Your mother and brothers are outside looking for you.”

“Who are my mother and my brothers?” he asked.

Then he looked at those seated in a circle around him and said, “Here are my mother and my brothers! Whoever does God’s will is my brother and sister and mother.”

(Mark 3:21,31-35, NIV)

Notice that Mark specifies that his family went to collect Jesus because they thought He had lost it. But when they — including Mary — arrived to take Jesus home, He refused because they were opposing “God’s will.”

Furthermore, to claim that Mary’s faith was better than Abraham’s is severely overstating the case. If her faith truly was superior, then it should have been mentioned at least once in the theological books of the New Testament when faith is discussed. But after the book of Acts mentions that Mary and her sons were praying with the apostles in the upper room on the day of Pentacost, she is never mentioned again. If her faith was superior/perfect, then she should certainly have at least been mentioned with other heros of faith in Hebrews chapter 11.

On the contrary, Jesus himself caused her anxiety and confusion by obeying God’s will when He was 12 years old. (See the entire story in Luke 2:41-52.)

And when they saw Him, they were astonished; and His mother said to Him, “Son, why have You treated us this way? Behold, Your father and I have been anxiously looking for You.” And He said to them, “Why is it that you were looking for Me? Did you not know that I had to be in My Father’s house?” And they did not understand the statement which He had made to them.

(Luke 2:48-50, NASB)

Notice that Mary forgot that God was Jesus’ father and that Jesus’ rebuke went over her head. And anxiety is a sign of weak faith:

Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.

(Phil. 4:6, NASB)

In short, the Bible never states that Mary’s faith was superior, perfect or unwavering. On the other hand, it definitely shows that Mary worried that Jesus was doing the wrong thing in at least two instances.

New Eve

Mary is next mentioned in paragraph 411:

411 The Christian tradition sees in this passage an announcement of the “New Adam” who, because he “became obedient unto death, even death on a cross”, makes amends superabundantly for the disobedience, of Adam.305 Furthermore many Fathers and Doctors of the Church have seen the woman announced in the Protoevangelium as Mary, the mother of Christ, the “new Eve”. Mary benefited first of all and uniquely from Christ’s victory over sin: she was preserved from all stain of original sin and by a special grace of God committed no sin of any kind during her whole earthly life.306

305 Cf. 1 Cor 15:21-22,45; Phil 2:8; Rom 5:19-20.
306 Cf. Pius IX, Ineffabilis Deus: DS 2803; Council of Trent: DS 1573.

Take a look at the footnotes again. The description of Jesus as the “New Adam” is well supported by scripture. However there is no scriptural support for calling Mary a “New Eve.” That doctrine is a pure invention of the RCC. It also places Mary on the same level as Jesus Christ as having some part in our salvation.

Not only that, the claim is made here that Mary was sinless for her entire life. Quite simply, the Bible never says that! In fact, it says the opposite:

And Mary said:
“My soul exalts the Lord,
And my spirit has rejoiced in God my Savior.”

(Luke 1:46-47, NASB)

The sinless do not need a savior.

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

(Rom. 3:23, NASB) Emphasis mine

as it is written, “There is none righteous, not even one;

(Rom. 3:10, NASB) Emphasis mine

If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

(1John 1:10, NASB)

For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.

(Rom. 5:19, NASB) Emphasis mine

Did you catch that? One not Two.

He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

(2Cor. 5:21, NASB)

Again, Jesus is the only (singular) one without sin.

For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in His steps, who committed no sin, nor was any deceit found in His mouth;

(1Pet. 2:21-22, NASB)

And you know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin.

(1John 3:5, NASB)

As you can see, there is plenty of scriptural support for Jesus being sinless. (This sampling only scratched the surface.) There is also plenty of scriptural support for all of humanity being sinners. (Again, I only scratched the surface.) There is a reference where Mary calls God her savior. And there is absolutely no scriptural support for the idea that Mary never sinned.

I’ve also already discussed that it was necessary for Mary to have a sin nature in Romanism, Ales Rarus and Mary: A Reply.

Without scriptural support, raising Mary (or anyone) to equivalence with Jesus amounts to blasphemy. It’s possible that later portions of the CCC may offer scriptural support. But the lack of such references right next to solid references for Jesus’ position makes such a possibility highly unlikely.

More To Come

Obviously, the CCC has much more to say about Mary. My copy of the CCC has 13 tabs marking spots which discuss Mary. I’ve only hit the first four.

To be continued…

See also:

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8 Responses to Romanism, Mary and The Catechism, Part 1

Trackbacks:

  1. Tempus Fugit on Ales Rarus:
    n his latest post, Ed does what no other Protestant with whom I've debated has done - actually read the Catechism. I'm so thoroughly pleased and impressed that I wish all the more that I had time to respond. He does a pretty thorough job fisking some...
  1. And the Wind Cried Mary on Ales Rarus:
    Sadly, I still haven't had time to properly respond to Ed Heckman's difficulties with the Church's beliefs concerning Mary. I did get one answer to my call for rebuttals from the peanut gallery. Here's Anonymous' defense of Marian doctrines...It seem...

Comments:

  1. Funky Dung writes:

    “Congratulations Funky!”

    Thanks smile

  1. Funky Dung writes:

    I have a small request to make.  Could you not refer to Catholicism as Romanism?  It’s a derogatory term and I think our rapport has developed beyond such language.  Also, it is not an accurate term.  There are more rites to the Catholic Church than just the Roman Rite.  IIRC, there at least 22 different rites in the Catholic Church.  The largest ones are probably Byzantine and Ukrainian.  Rites are not like denominations.  All the rites are united under the leadership of the Pope.  However, each has distinct liturgies, traditions, and histories.  To call all Catholics Romanists is to leave out a lot of people.  Furthermore, though the Eastern Orthodox are in schism, the Catholic Church recognizes their teaching authority and the validity of their holy orders.  Some strange aberrations have taken place within the last century, but on the whole, Eastern teachings are entirely compatible with Catholic teachings.  Thus, to insult Roman Catholic dogma and doctrine and label it “Romanism” often implies insult to Eastern Orthodox dogma and doctrines.  Actually, they’d probably be more insulted by the label than us since they’re less friendly toward us than we are toward them. ;)

  1. Ed "What the" Heckman writes:

    I’m currently using “Romanism” for several reasons:

    1 - Convenience. It’s a whole lot easier to use “Romanism” than to use “Roman Catholic Church” or “Roman Catholicism”.

    2 - It’s not “Catholic”. As I understand it, the term “catholic” means the entire body of believers in Christ, which would include me. It’s pretty obvious that I disagree with the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church and I’m trying to use a term which refers to Roman Catholicism as a distinct organization without including every believer in Christ. (The Presbyterian Church uses the Apostles’ Creed which uses the word “catholic” in this sense.) To use the term “catholic” would tend to imply that I’m disagreeing with myself. And I don’t really want to do that.  cool smile

    3 - It’s relatively easy to recognize as referring to Roman Catholicism since it’s a shortened version, much like “email” is a shortened version of “electronic mail.”

    I’m not trying to be offensive by using “Romanism”. I’m just trying to use a convenient shorthand. If you have a suggestion for a better term which is both convenient and accurate, please let me know.

  1. Funky Dung writes:

    To the best of my knowledge, it is perfectly safe to use Catholic (with a capital ‘C’) to denote those in union with Rome.  I’ve never before met a Protestant that had a problem with it.  You’re the first. ;) The Apostles’ Creed does use the word “catholic” (with small ‘c’) because it means “universal”.  I’ve never met anyone confused by the two meanings.  When I was Lutheran, I certainly understood the difference.  I am quite certain that if you use “Catholic” and “Catholicism” nobody will mistake your meaning.  They’re not much longer than “Roman” and “Romanism”, either. ;) “Fag” is a very short, convenient word for “homosexual”.  It’s also derogatory.  I could find lots of inappropriately short words for various groups of people (blacks, Jews, etc), but shorter isn’t always better.  I know you don’t mean to be insulting.  However, there are many other people, almost exclusively Fundamentalists, in the blogosphere and beyond, who use “Romanist” to describes Catholics as a means of insulting their faith, as if using the proper name would somehow dignify a faith they deny is Christian.

  1. Ed "What the" Heckman writes:
    The Apostles’ Creed does use the word “catholic” (with small ‘c’) because it means “universal”.  I’ve never met anyone confused by the two meanings.

    I’m not confused by it so much as uncomfortable with it and trying to avoid confusion.

    I’ll start using the term “Catholicism” but I’ll avoid the word “Catholic” to make sure I avoid any confusion on the part of my readers. I’ve updated the category name to use “Catholicism” and I’ll start using it in posts and in the title of any new series I start. But to keep from breaking existing links, keeping titles related to their links, and keeping new posts related to existing posts, I feel the need to leave “Romanism” in the title of the two existing series: “Romanism And Ales Rarus” and “Romanism, Mary and The Catechism”.

    Does that sound reasonable to you?

  1. Funky Dung writes:

    “Does that sound reasonable to you?”

    Very reasonable.  Thanks for being understanding about this. smile

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